Sorry - duplicate of previous post.
Hey BacardiSprite
I went through the entire thread in one go and I found it to be highly informative.
Now coming to my question.
What is your opinion on the Master of Engineering Management Programme in Dartmouth College. After working for 3 years as a design engineer in a Steel Manufacturing Sector, I feel the need to learn the other aspects of business, like finance,marketing.operations management.I would like to have a career in engineering/technology and one of my short term ambition is to become a project manager.I have gone through many courses and the degree at dartmouth really suited my interests.The course at Dartmouth has a very indepth focus in project management. I have gone through other similar programmes in Georgia Tech,Stanford but I found it be too in depth in quants.I think these programmes are ideal if one wants to enter into consulting. Please give your opinion on the MEM programme at Dartmouth.This would help me decide. Cheers
Anirudh
Engineering / Technology or Project Management in these or related industries are quant heavy jobs, so I wonder if it's prudent to reject a program simply because it's quant heavy (i.e exactly the skills & competencies you need).
Dartmouth's MEM is a relatively new program compared to Industrial Engineering, Operations / Tech Management programs offered by some of the other schools. I would place GaTech, Stanford above Dartmouth. Have you also taken a look at MIT's LGO program? Michigan's MBA with the Manufacturing & Supply Chain specialization? Kellogg's MMM program (MBA + MS in Manufacturing & Supply Chain). How about an Engineering Systems Masters at MIT's ESD?
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hey, I am a fresh BE(Mechanical) passout. I want to get into consulting. I know that most consultancies hire MBAs only. Is there any MS programme that would help me in this regard.
Thanks
Yes - the major strat consultants do hire Master's Degree holders from the major US Universities, however - anecdotal evidence however suggests these are rarer than MBA hires.
The path of lowest potential resistance is 3-4 years in a hard-core functional job in industry, then an MBA in a top school in the US or EU, then consulting, and that's what I would recommend.
All the best
Baccardisprite
hi
can you please suggest me some best universities or colleges abroad offering good courses in marketing and supply chain management and international business
Thanks
preeti
Hi
Nice can you please give some tips for GMAT
preeti
Hi Everybody,
Well this thread shall inculcate all info regarding commodity trading programmes.
University de geneva offers this programme along with parttime job so your fee is not much but living expenses are there.
Masters in international trading commodity finance and shipping
Cass business school, Uk also offers this programme.
Msc in shipping trade and finance
so like if any body can share information about these programmes + any student enrolled in this programme or alumni associated with this programme. There contact details can be shared in order to have word of advise before going for admission run
Thanks
Mba-Mba
Hey
It is commonly known that outside Europe there is a great number of people that sees studying in Europe, and especially in the UK valuable for their career and there is loads of families that can afford sending their off springs to do so even for higher prices than the ones paid by UK/EU nationals. For more information about studying in the UK check International Students at Nottingham University.
What do you think? Has studying in the UK or Europe changed your life?
Hi baccardisprite,
I have gone through all the posts in the thread. really very very helpful.
Currently I am in Final year of my Electronics & Communication Engg.
Wanted to do MBA from abroad(US preferably) later in my career after
some Work ex.
My acads are good,
X - 88.67%
XII - 78.40%
BE upto THIRD YEAR( V sem) - 72.57%
*I am in complete dilemma what to do next? As per my qualification of BE and my knowledge into subject i can't think of getting into technical line. Also placements from my college limits only to Software comp. like TCS and Infosys from my background. Personally I don't like programming jobs. As it is not the field where i would like to see myself in near future.
*I always wanted to make BIG in my life and career thats why I also dropped one year after my XII for IIT-JEE prep. but couldnt make it.
*In some previous posts u have mentioned that u student should not limit themselves only to the on-campus jobs the should also try hard for OFF campus jobs.That has relevant only, If one is in top engineering colleges to obtain a job in like finance/IB field being a engineering student.
*In the process of job searching I came through 1 yesr MSc courses offered by UK universities. like in MSc in Management, MSc in finance/Investment banking and etc.
*but you have mentioned that present day job market is not good for INDIAN students to acquire a job there. If i am taking admission it will b in 2011 and graduating in 2012 .by then job market will improve don't you think?
Also in what field should i take MSc course.( As you have already said it dpends on which field attracts me most? where i would like to see myself?
but being an Engg guy i dont hav much exposure to these fields But at the same time i m willing to do hard work to attain skills in the field said)
Also u have mentioned that for ppl trying to take a job in UK should have a knowlwdge of French/German/Spanish.. but till now i dont have knowledge of them.
Will you please guide me what should i do at this point of time ? Also my prep for CAT 10 is not so good still 1 month is left to the exam.
how should i hunt job into IB/Finance field in India or
should i take MSc course from UK which will give me good job (In Finance /IB/PRivate equity...etc)there and gain exposure , skills , experience there for 4-5 years then go ahead with my MBA which will also support my MBA funding.
Also i don't belong to rich affluent family so i have to take loan of 20 lacs for my MSc in UK for 1 year course? Is it advisable??
pleas guide me well...!!!!
Also I have shortlisted some B schools
1) CASS Business School
2) Warwick business School
3) Manchester Business School
4) Aston Business School
5) Cambridge(Judge) Business School
Sorry for such a long post but have to clear myself clear.
Any help/ guidance will be much appreciated in this regard.
Thanks in advance..!!!!
Hi baccardisprite,
Need some words of wisdom
I've been working with a telecom major (Ericsson) for about two years now. However, I have IT profile. (a brief mentioned in my signature)
My post MBA target industry is : High Tech.
Why ?
I want to progress from Technical to the business line of the company.Not looking for a career switch.As a long term goal I'd want to be in a executive position with a software tech company. Looking into the near future, I'd like to make progression from tech side of things into perhaps, product management/strategy/marketing & sales for Tech companies.
Location preference would be : Silicon Valley / India.
Now,I am Considering some JD programs besides a hardcore 'MBA'.
I am interested in MBA + MS ( Computer Science ) or equivalent programs.
Why ?
I believe a MS will provide more breath to my existing knowledge and skill set relative to my target industry. MBA will help me learn the necessary business skills.
Some of the programs I have highlighted in my RnD are:
MIT's LGO Progam.
UCLA's MBA/MCS (Computer Science) program
Ross's MSIM program
Can you comment on my decision to look for them ?
Will they provide a extra advantage when looking for my target industry ?
Are they recommended for a profile like me ? (Considering I'd have around 32 months exp. at the time of matriculation,etc)
What are the other programs that you recommend ?
I am inclined towards such programs from the US only as I believe it will be difficult to find relevant jobs in my target industry if I pursue from Europe( my other foreign option). Your comments ?
And I would appreciate if you could also comment on my choice of B-Schools for a pure MBA considering my profile and future goals :
MIT Sloan, Tepper, Stanford ,UCLA Anderson,Haas.
Thanks in advance.
Regards,
trailblazer123
Apologies for not having responded to you before. Been busy at work and unable to log on to PG for over a month now.
Anyway to your questions - while your goal is clear, if you're thinking of applying for a 2011 fall entry - I think your experience is a bit thin. While the schools chosen make sense --> schools attached to universities with top engineering schools, attendees to their programs (MBA programs) are normally 5-6 years experienced and have a lot to offer to their future employers.
You can do an MSIM, but working for Ericsson, do you really need it? You're combining an IT job & telecom industry experience in one shot... Why waste what you're learning now and spend money on an MSIM.
Recommend concentrate on staying in your job for another 2-3 years and then going for an MBA. The LGO program is for those who wish to stay in hardcore operations jobs (manufacturing, supply chain, process engg etc..) for at least 4-5 years after the MBA after which they move to more general management roles.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hi baccardisprite,
I have gone through all the posts in the thread. really very very helpful.
Currently I am in Final year of my Electronics & Communication Engg.
Wanted to do MBA from abroad(US preferably) later in my career after
some Work ex.
My acads are good,
X - 88.67%
XII - 78.40%
BE upto THIRD YEAR( V sem) - 72.57%
*I am in complete dilemma what to do next? As per my qualification of BE and my knowledge into subject i can't think of getting into technical line. Also placements from my college limits only to Software comp. like TCS and Infosys from my background. Personally I don't like programming jobs. As it is not the field where i would like to see myself in near future.
*I always wanted to make BIG in my life and career thats why I also dropped one year after my XII for IIT-JEE prep. but couldnt make it.
*In some previous posts u have mentioned that u student should not limit themselves only to the on-campus jobs the should also try hard for OFF campus jobs.That has relevant only, If one is in top engineering colleges to obtain a job in like finance/IB field being a engineering student.
*In the process of job searching I came through 1 yesr MSc courses offered by UK universities. like in MSc in Management, MSc in finance/Investment banking and etc.
*but you have mentioned that present day job market is not good for INDIAN students to acquire a job there. If i am taking admission it will b in 2011 and graduating in 2012 .by then job market will improve don't you think?
Also in what field should i take MSc course.( As you have already said it dpends on which field attracts me most? where i would like to see myself?
but being an Engg guy i dont hav much exposure to these fields But at the same time i m willing to do hard work to attain skills in the field said)
Also u have mentioned that for ppl trying to take a job in UK should have a knowlwdge of French/German/Spanish.. but till now i dont have knowledge of them.
Will you please guide me what should i do at this point of time ? Also my prep for CAT 10 is not so good still 1 month is left to the exam.
how should i hunt job into IB/Finance field in India or
should i take MSc course from UK which will give me good job (In Finance /IB/PRivate equity...etc)there and gain exposure , skills , experience there for 4-5 years then go ahead with my MBA which will also support my MBA funding.
Also i don't belong to rich affluent family so i have to take loan of 20 lacs for my MSc in UK for 1 year course? Is it advisable??
pleas guide me well...!!!!
Also I have shortlisted some B schools
1) CASS Business School
2) Warwick business School
3) Manchester Business School
4) Aston Business School
5) Cambridge(Judge) Business School
Sorry for such a long post but have to clear myself clear.
Any help/ guidance will be much appreciated in this regard.
Thanks in advance..!!!!
You're highly confused, and any advice I give around "education" is not going to help you now - please take my word for it.
As for just TCS or Infosys - come on! Surely there're other companies in India that will hire you. Have you thought of BPO companies doing analytics, have you thought of some of the public sector majors (MUL, IOCL, BPCL, HPCL, NTPC, SAIL, GAIL) which offer a lot of programs for engineers? Have you thought of applying to the GET programs of major engineering and manufacturing companies? Do you know people who work in these companies? If these companies don't come to campus, then start preparing for their entrance exams!
Granted you're likely to get into "technical / engineering" jobs, but you'll learn something. Get a job first! Work for a few years, learn something, then go for an MBA. While in your job (and earning / saving money) spend wisely on financial courses like the CFA (if your passion is finance) or the ICWA and pass the levels. If possible, get into a financial role in the company you work for....
You can't simply go get an M.Sc and hope all your challenges are addressed! Work smart, work hard, and you'll get there. Be patient, be disciplined, persistent and diligent.
All the best
Baccardisprite
You're highly confused, and any advice I give around "education" is not going to help you now - please take my word for it.
As for just TCS or Infosys - come on! Surely there're other companies in India that will hire you. Have you thought of BPO companies doing analytics, have you thought of some of the public sector majors (MUL, IOCL, BPCL, HPCL, NTPC, SAIL, GAIL) which offer a lot of programs for engineers? Have you thought of applying to the GET programs of major engineering and manufacturing companies? Do you know people who work in these companies? If these companies don't come to campus, then start preparing for their entrance exams!
Granted you're likely to get into "technical / engineering" jobs, but you'll learn something. Get a job first! Work for a few years, learn something, then go for an MBA. While in your job (and earning / saving money) spend wisely on financial courses like the CFA (if your passion is finance) or the ICWA and pass the levels. If possible, get into a financial role in the company you work for....
You can't simply go get an M.Sc and hope all your challenges are addressed! Work smart, work hard, and you'll get there. Be patient, be disciplined, persistent and diligent.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hello bacaardisprite,
thanks for your suggestion!!
but I am interested in MBA finally. then why should i waste 2-3 years (As applicable) to learning programming languages like JAVA/Dotnet...etc
when there is way to do MSc(only 1 year) after that i can get a good job in finance/IB/Management field.
My main concern is that should i go for it or not accd to the job prospects in UK??? As i have to take loan..??
May be i didnt undestand fully your opinion..make me correct if i am wrong??
Plz guide me ??
what should i do? how should i approach if i have to take job in INdia in finance /IB field?
Also to make my profile better..!!!
thankssss!!!!
Hello bacaardisprite,
thanks for your suggestion!!
but I am interested in MBA finally. then why should i waste 2-3 years (As applicable) to learning programming languages like JAVA/Dotnet...etc
when there is way to do MSc(only 1 year) after that i can get a good job in finance/IB/Management field.
My main concern is that should i go for it or not accd to the job prospects in UK??? As i have to take loan..??
May be i didnt undestand fully your opinion..make me correct if i am wrong??
Plz guide me ??
what should i do? how should i approach if i have to take job in INdia in finance /IB field?
Also to make my profile better..!!!
thankssss!!!!
Is Java / .NET or any other form of Software Engineering the only thing you can think of after your engineering. The companies I have suggested are NOT software / IT companies. They offer core functional jobs in engineering, operations and going forward potentially finance if you can make the internal switch. You could gain the experience for 3-4 years, give the CFA exam to gain a professionally endorsed and respected qualification, then get an MBA and switch over to finance unless you have already managed it before. But you'll have something to offer your future employer in finance.
You can do an M.Sc in a UK school, but the global market in finance & banking is now not great at all. Many financiers and bankers of all types lost their jobs in the 2008-2009 period (you know what happened). Things have recovered a bit, but the number of jobs are not as numerous as they were previously, and the ones got lost their jobs (& have experience) will have first crack at any job that comes live again. Things are a bit better in India & Asia who have somewhat escaped the global financial crisis; which translates into better job markets in these countries. So you might be better of studying in India, don't you think?
What makes you think that you will be able to offer an employer in the UK / EU anything compared to a local? You don't have finance experience, you have no cultural experience outside India (unless you have travelled extensively or lived abroad previously)?
If you're in such a rush to study an MBA, do so in India - prepare for the CAT, do well and try attending one of the big name IIMs / FMS / SP Jain (PGDM in Fin), IMT / MDI; and you'll get a shot at finance jobs.
Given all of this - why waste yourself, why borrow so much money, when you can do what you want in India, including finance?
Anyway - I don't want to think for you, so have have provided a few pointers for guidance.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Can also look into Masters programmes in the US - for example MS&E; at Stanford
Hi Baccardisprite,
Thanks for all the help you have been providing to the PGs over the last several years.
I like your responses- I find them very straight forward, very informative and insightful. I appreciate your approach.
I have a query; please give your insightful comments.
One of my relatives has the following profile:
Indian Citizen & Singapore PR/Female/25 years/ GMAT:740 ( 49/42)
Education: BBM from SMU, Singapore (GPA 3.75/4.0); pursuing Masters in China studies (Part-time at NTU)
Work Exp: 3 years (by July, 2011)-Working in one of the Big4 (advisory) in Singapore.
Extra-curriculars: reasonably good but not outstanding (university debate team; scuba-diving; member of CSR in her organization etc)
Foreign Languages: French ( Intermediate Level of Proficiency); Spanish and Italian (Rudimentary knowledge)
The dilemma is this:
Should she wait for a year and apply for MBA to some of the top schools or is it worthwhile doing a Masters programme in Europe ( of 1 1/2 to 2 years duration), then try and work in Europe for a year or two and then apply for MBA? It looks like there are some good schools where the fee is relatively low, like St. Gallen/ Copenhagen B-school; Norwegian School of Business etc.!
Is it worthwhile doing Masters at this juncture, given that she would have 3 years of experience and that too in a fairly good company, by the time of joining Masters programme ? Aren't Masters programmes in Europe mainly targeted towards students without much experience? Would she be disadvataged on account of her extra experience at the time of looking for jobs?
She is reasonably ambitious but may not be among the top 2 or 3% in terms of ambition 😃 She desires to have an international career at least for the next 5 to 10 years; maybe later on in life she might want to settle down in India- that too not certain!
Can you please suggest any other alternatives/ possibilities/ paths to achieve the goals she has in mind?
I keenly await for your insightful comments and suggestions.
Thanks and regards,
Nothing1954
Thanks a lot for the +ve feedback.
If she's working a core function (advisory / transactions / audit etc) for a Big-4 advisory, could she look for / request for a posting to Europe as a career development opportunity? Big 4's and Strat houses routinely transfer employees across regions for career development?
Unless a Master's now offers any thing to complement the bag of professional skills she has acquired in the last 3 years, I wonder if there's any value spending money on things she might already know. She needs to answer that question for herself, everything else follows from that. If she wants to work in Europe, learning a european language like French, German or Spanish might work better as a tabgible skill than a degree which may or not add too many skills.
If she decides there's little to be gained professionally, personally or notionally from a Master's degree now, I'd suggest wait this year out and apply to enter a top notch b-school in fall 2012. She's got or developing all the attributes for a Top 5 entry.
Hope that helps
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hi Bacardi
Let me start by saying that this is an excellent thread and a welcome break from the thousands of MBA threads on this website. I wanted to ask you which of the following two options will give me the best possible chance of getting a job in the financial industry in India:
Graduate with a BSc in Economics from a top 10 university in UK and get a job at a small/SME accounting firm or a trainee accountants role and study for the ACCA/ACA (for arguments sake assume I don't get a job with a mid/big company)
Do a MS Finance degree from the London School of Economics and try and get a job in India
My profile so far is I am on course for a First in my degree and have three internships (Big 4 corporate finance/ Grant Thornton Tax/ Asian bank spring week)
Cheers mate.
Hi Bacardi
Let me start by saying that this is an excellent thread and a welcome break from the thousands of MBA threads on this website. I wanted to ask you which of the following two options will give me the best possible chance of getting a job in the financial industry in India:
Graduate with a BSc in Economics from a top 10 university in UK and get a job at a small/SME accounting firm or a trainee accountants role and study for the ACCA/ACA (for arguments sake assume I don't get a job with a mid/big company)
Do a MS Finance degree from the London School of Economics and try and get a job in India
My profile so far is I am on course for a First in my degree and have three internships (Big 4 corporate finance/ Grant Thornton Tax/ Asian bank spring week)
Cheers mate.
Good question! I'll assume from your profile that you are based in the UK now (?). If you were in India, I'd have suggested a degree in India alongside a professional qualification (Indian ACA/ICWA).
Don't rush. Since you're in the UK, the path of least resistance (to a job in India medium to long term) could be to get into a big 4 in audit / corp fin / transaction advisory, get an ACCA/ACA alongside. What would help professionally would be to work with Indian clients having significant UK operations or large UK clients having substantial operations in India. Once you've established an early career (2-3 years) and some experience with the suggested type of clients, you might find employers in India more welcoming for your kind of skills. Try & spread your wings more into transaction / corp fin advisory over & above audit... so your skills are a little broader, therefore more widely applicable. A CFA might help you after you complete the ACCA/ACA (or perhaps an ACMA particularly if you get into transaction advisory / financial control kind of projects).
The above said, I could be wrong, so a second opinion might be useful.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Good question! I'll assume from your profile that you are based in the UK now (?). If you were in India, I'd have suggested a degree in India alongside a professional qualification (Indian ACA/ICWA).
Don't rush. Since you're in the UK, the path of least resistance (to a job in India medium to long term) could be to get into a big 4 in audit / corp fin / transaction advisory, get an ACCA/ACA alongside. What would help professionally would be to work with Indian clients having significant UK operations or large UK clients having substantial operations in India. Once you've established an early career (2-3 years) and some experience with the suggested type of clients, you might find employers in India more welcoming for your kind of skills. Try & spread your wings more into transaction / corp fin advisory over & above audit... so your skills are a little broader, therefore more widely applicable. A CFA might help you after you complete the ACCA/ACA (or perhaps an ACMA particularly if you get into transaction advisory / financial control kind of projects).
The above said, I could be wrong, so a second opinion might be useful.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hi Bacardi
Many thanks for your reply. Indeed the ideal path would be to get a job at the big 4, get my ACA qualification and then move to India. However, realistically due to the poor job market it is unlikely I will get a job with any of the big accounting firms. I will most probably have to settle with a small high street accounting firm.
Would a MS Finance from LSE really hold no weight in India if I am looking for my first job? Don't the big companies like Reliance in India hire people with foreign degrees and no work experience?
What I am really asking is that if I did my masters from LSE, how would I go about looking for a job in India?
I hope you understand what I am trying to say!
Many thanks once again.
Hi Bacardi
Many thanks for your reply. Indeed the ideal path would be to get a job at the big 4, get my ACA qualification and then move to India. However, realistically due to the poor job market it is unlikely I will get a job with any of the big accounting firms. I will most probably have to settle with a small high street accounting firm.
Would a MS Finance from LSE really hold no weight in India if I am looking for my first job? Don't the big companies like Reliance in India hire people with foreign degrees and no work experience?
What I am really asking is that if I did my masters from LSE, how would I go about looking for a job in India?
I hope you understand what I am trying to say!
Many thanks once again.
With an Econ degree under your belt and a professional accounting qualification now & later on the job, what skills / competencies is an M.Sc likely to offer now over & above what you'll learn + do on the job?
There's really no substitute to experience. Even if a small high-street accounting firm - go for it. What would happen? You'll probably be exposed to a culture that's less corporate / process driven / structured than a big 4, but faster, more dynamic & entrepreneurial than in a Big 4. Is that such a bad thing? Don't rush for more degrees at 21 when you have a chance to truly learn something real. Secondly - in a bad job market, do you really want to spurn the chance to work.
I've said this in umpteen posts before with the benefit of experience and hindsight - your future employer (some years from now), whatever the geography will hire you 75% for the real world skills you bring to the job, and 25% on your education.
Specifically for you - you could spend the first 2-3 years in the firm working and qualifying for ACA/ACCA, then do the M.Sc in LSE or the MiF in LBS part-time, then take both experience and a top notch education east. India will be growing 4-5 years from now unless something changes quite dramatically.
All the best
Baccardisprite
Hey BaccardiSprite...
I just came across this thread.. hopefully you can offer some insight in my case (as you've done for countless others)...
Let me offer some background on myself.
I did my undergrad in Computer Science from a second tier US college.
During the undergrad, interned in Intel for 2 years. Got some development and testing experience.
Once graduated, joined the consulting team for a niche software consulting firm. Became an expert in implementing their products (which were for sales compensation).
Was in consulting role for 2 years. Focused on insurance companies as clients.
Got laid off, then joined a client in a full time resident expert role (in the same technology). I'm currently leading the system administration for the system that handles multi-million dollar payments every two weeks. Also have a team in India supporting me. Have been here for almost 1.5 yrs now.
Now the issue. I'm absolutely bored at this job. While consulting was borderline fun (due to the travel aspect), at this job I can literally count my brain cells rotting away. I see myself as a creative person. Love to write, take pics, travel (have blogs for all that).. A sys admin role where the system breaks once a week and then I'm needed for 10 mins.. that is extremely boring. Of course it pays well. But I can see myself doing better and more challenged in something with more people interaction... something like marketing or sales. Hell.. I'm even considering applying to Journalism schools for Masters. Am very confused.
Applied to ISB last year, but didn't get in. The collective wisdom of friends/family is that I should now apply to bunch of MBA schools to assure that I get in somewhere.. and then "life will be good".. I somehow don't agree. From your posts above, it seems that you're a big proponent of really understanding what we're looking for life, before jumping into an expensive degree program. I completely agree. Just don't know what direction to take...
To get into a sales/marketing role, seems like MBA would be one obvious possibility. To somehow convert my passions into my career, Journalism would be another obvious choice (but not very friendly to people around me). Just don't want into another ditch just coz I'm tired of my current role.
Would appreciate any comments.. Thanks!
Journalism could be an option after an MBA too... I think an MBA would be good to get more clarity on your options