International educational options beyond the MBA

MBA
856
rust in peace Says
From what I head, some Indian LSE grads do end up in Dubai/Singapore, you have to start networking and job hunting before your course even begins (as it is a 1 year course), I guess you are best off contacting some Indian Alums, as work visa policies are very different for EU nationals


well i hope to god ur rite:)(abt the dubai/singapore bit i mean)...i dont really mind the job hunt and stuff but its kinda hard to do LSE when i know that I could probly sleep at IMT for 1.5 yrs and still get atleast a >7 lac placement whereas at LSE wit a job hunt+part time work+studying my ass off+3lac odd extra in terms of tuition+cat'11...i mite wind up with nothing!!! altho if I do wind up with something...i guess its really gonna be worth it:) btw, did u apply to the oxford mfe? im still awaiting a reply from them.altho i still like my LSE offer better in terms of the course offerings and tuition fee..and thats another factor..cos i dont want a pure finance role anyway.have my heart set on consulting/gen or strategic management cos im not sure if im goin to like investment banking and all that very much:(.well yeah i did try going on linkedin yesterday to look for some alumni..but then started watching a FRIENDS rerun instead..will be doin that soon..i really do wish i could get Baccardi's perspective on this also.. where is he?.and if I go to LSE now and do IIM/XL/FMS in 2012...will that extra lse degree finally help me in the placements I get?(assuming i cant land a job i like)..cos I will be superior to the other candidates in terms of academic knowledge right? cos im sure a year at lse is worth 2 yrs at coding..which is wht most of batchmates will probly have..or am I being very naive abt that? god im so confused rite now:lookround:..anyway where are u headed...anything in the pipeline?
857
Thanks for the elaborate responses, TraderJoe1976 & 1431. It is extremely encouraging and heartwarming to get responses from people who've been there & done that.



I read on some forums that the programs run by the business schools have a full fledged career services department which usually means you've a better chance of securing a job of your choice whereas with IEOR departments you're kind of on your own. Is this true?

I skipped Princeton MS Fin because I was looking at 1 year programs; Can't afford a 2 year program.



I don't mind starting out as a hardcore quant, but that's not what I want to do throughout my career.




I just wanted to know if my not so stellar math grades spell doomsday for my MFE dreams :lookround: (after mitigating with GRE Subject Math)



Sure, I'd love to read that book. Reading random interesting books was the reason my grades dipped 😛 .

I want to be at a Global Macro HF because I like International Macroeconomics/Finance (academics/research/reading, and had an internship at a Forex Trading Desk) and it probably involves networking with a lot of high profile individuals from the top echelons of politics, policymaking, etc. Glamour is a trivial aspect of it, for me. Might sound naive to you, so please correct me if I am wrong. Where can I learn more about Global Macro HFs? Or HFs in General? It gives me that adrenalin rush.

Basically, I'm really fond of the wannabe-philosopher breed of Investors like Peter Thiel, Soros, Ray Dalio. When I read something they talk about, it seems that they have a deep insight and macro perspective of the world around us, not just finance. They have real purpose in their lives besides making money (which according to them is a residual byproduct of pursuing their principles) - be it opening societies, or meditating and things like that. Somehow, all of these people run Global Macro Hedge funds, so its like killing two birds with one arrow for me - academic interest + deep insight.



Sir, this is very helpful!

One of my friends just got an admit from Said for that program.

May I know why you recommend that order specifically for Global Macro Hedge Funds?

How would LSE MSc Finance fare in this regard?

Thanks a ton again for your valuable time and responses!



1.) AFAIK the reputed FE programs which aren't a part of a b-school are good on their own and you may never need the career services of a b-school. For better jobs prospects target FE programs at financial hubs (NY, London, Hong Kong) or premier schools. Courant @ New York would be more preferable to a similar program at a non-financial centre.

2.) Don't worry too much about your Maths' grades. It's past. Focus on what you can do better from now like a great GRE Maths score :)

3.) Oxford is preferable for you because-
i) at most of the FE programs the focus is on fixed income/ derivative / exotics modeling and product creation. Oxford program is a niche program which focuses on Econometrics - your focus area.
ii) It offers more bang for the buck. US FE programs are atleast 40-50% dearer than Oxford's MFE program. And this is not because of quality of education. If you are not from one of India's richest families then read ahead else don't. I always believe in having low level of personal indebtedness, so one can enjoy life as an ad says, khul ke. :)

4.) LSE MSc Finance is good but it is a generic program more suited to people looking at generalist roles in finance.
858

Profile:
Btech mech : Thapar university 7.7 CGPA
Work-ex: 3 years (Hindustan Petroleum Corporation Limited)
Have been handling Operations & internal audits. I m looking for a role in Operations/supply chain management
Please guide me whether I should look for MS/MSc for seeking desired job opportunity in the operations sector or I should go for MBA with operations as Major. Considering my work-ex 3 years please suggest me some univs. Other option I think of is gaining some more work-ex like total of around 5 or 6 years and simultaneously building my profile with certifications like PMP etc and handling more diverse profiles in my current job.
So suggest me which option to go for like some specific one year course related to operaions/SCM aftr 5 yrs work-ex or Genral MBA with Operations as Major next year.

859
Surabhi M Says
well i hope to god ur rite(abt the dubai/singapore bit i mean)...i dont really mind the job hunt and stuff but its kinda hard to do LSE when i know that I could probly sleep at IMT for 1.5 yrs and still get atleast a >7 lac placement whereas at LSE wit a job hunt+part time work+studying my ass off+3lac odd extra in terms of tuition+cat'11...i mite wind up with nothing!!! altho if I do wind up with something...i guess its really gonna be worth it btw, did u apply to the oxford mfe? im still awaiting a reply from them.altho i still like my LSE offer better in terms of the course offerings and tuition fee..and thats another factor..cos i dont want a pure finance role anyway.have my heart set on consulting/gen or strategic management cos im not sure if im goin to like investment banking and all that very much:(.well yeah i did try going on linkedin yesterday to look for some alumni..but then started watching a FRIENDS rerun instead..will be doin that soon..i really do wish i could get Baccardi's perspective on this also.. where is he?.and if I go to LSE now and do IIM/XL/FMS in 2012...will that extra lse degree finally help me in the placements I get?(assuming i cant land a job i like)..cos I will be superior to the other candidates in terms of academic knowledge right? cos im sure a year at lse is worth 2 yrs at coding..which is wht most of batchmates will probly have..or am I being very naive abt that? god im so confused rite now..anyway where are u headed...anything in the pipeline?


Don't mean to sound harsh (I myself am applying to Fin & Econ, Fin & Pvt Equity at LSE), but LSE is commonly referred to as a Master's supermarket. The degrees are all very expensive considering the fact that they don't provide career services (which is not that big an issue because they have career fairs, the school is next door to BBs). But some programs do have a good record for placement into BBs (fin, fin & econ). LSE/OxBridge get you interview calls, it is up to you after that (this is what they tell me on WSO, StudentRoom). Some programs like the ones I mentioned, have an established track record of placement (The situation might be different for Indian Nationals). But as you must have realized by now, LSE's curriculum is barely rigorous (Fin & Econ, EME being exceptions). My friends who've studied there tell me it is like having a bunch of buildings in connaught place in delhi where lectures take place, and that is kind of it. 5 courses in 9 months, I doubt is much. Everybody's in it to have a crack at the job opportunities in the City.

If you want to go to LSE just to learn Acct & Finance and not to get a job, it is not worth it at all. You'd much rather get Diploma In Finance and Accounting from the LSE external system at 1/15th the cost from India. You just have to write exams.

From what I hear, attending classes at LSE is also not compulsory, and you could just sit at home, study and write the exams.

Ideally, after LSE, you should get the roles IIM grads get in india. I don't know how the Indian Job market works, and how they treat LSE grads for recruiting.

My verdict :Go to LSE if you want an international career (and you have sufficient scope of a job) Don't go with the intention of returning to India to do more IIM degrees. Also, since you mentioned that you werent sure about finance roles, why dont you consider Master of Management and Strategy at LSE? or MiM at LBS?I think you should consider LBS MiM.

My pipeline, lol. Justfinished my coursework for MSc Economics & BE Electronics Instrumentation at BITS Pilani. Have a Coop sort of internship with JPMorgan Chase/Goldman Sachs/Credit Suisse next year. Hoping to convert this rather long internship into a job. Plan to follow it up with CFA L2 GRE Subject Math armed applications to LSE, MFE @ Oxford, MFE UCB Haas, Need to test the waters and see how much weight it needs.
860
Don't mean to sound harsh (I myself am applying to Fin & Econ, Fin & Pvt Equity at LSE), but LSE is commonly referred to as a Master's supermarket.
well i know a thing or two abt dat!! they hav an Msc in gender studies!!!!lol..not dat there's anything wrong with erm... gender studies:lookround:
The degrees are all very expensive considering the fact that they don't provide career services (which is not that big an issue because they have career fairs, the school is next door to BBs).
Well i dunno abt dat cos its much cheaper than oxbridge or any us school. and yes its a lot more exp than any other uk school but i dont see the point in going to any uk school thats not lse/oxbridge.esp now and esp for international students.
But some programs do have a good record for placement into BBs (fin, fin & econ).
well from what i know and have heard employers dont care much which course u do unless its smthng ttly inane...esp from the whole finance courses bunch that they have. they just look at the school u go to. plus my course has all the courses shared with fin math and eco&fin;+other deptts, well except for 1 course...so i thot greater flexibility wud be nice for sm1 as confused as me;) plus its a whole lot cheaper than fin..i dunno abt fin&eco..esp; cos its 9 months vs 10.
LSE/OxBridge get you interview calls, it is up to you after that (this is what they tell me on WSO, StudentRoom). Some programs like the ones I mentioned, have an established track record of placement (The situation might be different for Indian Nationals). But as you must have realized by now, LSE's curriculum is barely rigorous (Fin & Econ, EME being exceptions). My friends who've studied there tell me it is like having a bunch of buildings in connaught place in delhi where lectures take place, and that is kind of it. 5 courses in 9 months, I doubt is much. Everybody's in it to have a crack at the job opportunities in the City.

If you want to go to LSE just to learn Acct & Finance and not to get a job, it is not worth it at all. You'd much rather get Diploma In Finance and Accounting from the LSE external system at 1/15th the cost from India. You just have to write exams.

From what I hear, attending classes at LSE is also not compulsory, and you could just sit at home, study and write the exams.

Ideally, after LSE, you should get the roles IIM grads get in india. I don't know how the Indian Job market works, and how they treat LSE grads for recruiting.

My verdict :Go to LSE if you want an international career (and you have sufficient scope of a job) Don't go with the intention of returning to India to do more IIM degrees. Also, since you mentioned that you werent sure about finance roles, why dont you consider Master of Management and Strategy at LSE? or MiM at LBS?I think you should consider LBS MiM.

well the cat'11 was a backup plan incase i cant get nything substantial out of lse which from the stories ive heard is likely its like u cud wind up wit nothin or u cud alternatively wind up wit a 60000gbp job thrice our tuition fee:cheerio:..and how am i supposed to predetermine my job opp now?:o.well if im in the former situation altho im gonna try damn hard NOT to be... it wudnt be very nice bcos they dont care if u went to lse here all that much and i guess they wud know how desperate ur situation is if ur job hunting in india and then try to squeeze u..i have recurring nightmares of how im gonna get a 20000rs job after paying in lacs for my degree. so then i think trying to leverage ur lse degree in a top notch indian b-school placement might make sense..again not smthing im sure abt tho..and well since i will not hav emis and loan payments to worry abt..i thot this was something i very well may consider..the reason im not considering an mim is bcos ive heard from several ppl that they're pretty lame and a very sad substitute for a mba..no less from the starter of this thread altho in a much politer manner:) and well acc to my frnd at lse(doin msc in fin there and the sourse of most of my info)..25% of the various fin courses junta opt for and do consulting jobs so i should be good. well actually acc to him i could evn do a mktg job if i like as long as i hav lse on the resume and a good enuf reason...but i do think thats a little extreme.well i dunno really..mayb i shud stick wit imt and choose to do smthing specialised later.. or take cat'11 while at imt..that way i hav nothing to lose...well except a year of my life...:(
My pipeline, lol. Justfinished my coursework for MSc Economics & BE Electronics Instrumentation at BITS Pilani. Have a Coop sort of internship with JPMorgan Chase/Goldman Sachs/Credit Suisse next year. Hoping to convert this rather long internship into a job. Plan to follow it up with CFA L2 GRE Subject Math armed applications to LSE, MFE @ Oxford, MFE UCB Haas, Need to test the waters and see how much weight it needs.sounds good..but wudnt u b betr off just applyin to places in the us?pricier i know.but betr reputed for the ms fin courses+betr job opp+no crazy visa issues&labor; mkt tests. i know i wud but i hav a 3ydc:(
861

well i know a thing or two abt dat!! they hav an Msc in gender studies!!!!lol..not dat there's anything wrong with erm... gender studies

Nothing wrong with that, it's just that all the programs lead to (more or less) the same job market. Changing half a unit of curriculum and making 6 different programs out of it is just.....insane. It'd be much better if it was 1 single course with that flexibility.


Well i dunno abt dat cos its much cheaper than oxbridge or any us school. and yes its a lot more exp than any other uk school but i dont see the point in going to any uk school thats not lse/oxbridge.esp now and esp for international students.


That is true. But LBS MiM costs the same, and depending on your previous background (education, experience), you could make a compelling case for the same jobs as from LSE. I know seniors from BITS who now have PE/HF jobs (they had CS background) after MiM from LBS, which offers fantastic careers support. Again, its curriculum is very generalist, but it gets you that interview call.

well from what i know and have heard employers dont care much which course u do unless its smthng ttly inane...esp from the whole finance courses bunch that they have. they just look at the school u go to. plus my course has all the courses shared with fin math and eco&fin;+other deptts, well except for 1 course...so i thot greater flexibility wud be nice for sm1 as confused as me plus its a whole lot cheaper than fin..i dunno abt fin&eco..esp; cos its 9 months vs 10.

I have heard that too, but regardless of the courses being the same, *some* programs have a reputation of placing better into certain types of roles, just a better brand in the market. You could make it with Acct & Fin too, but no doubt Fin & Econ or Fin Math would be more suitable for quant(er) roles. Don't know much about IB though, because that'd require more accounting knowledge and lesser math. But then as you said, what you studied barely matters.

If you're keen on consulting, why not MSc management & strategy?

well the cat'11 was a backup plan incase i cant get nything substantial out of lse which from the stories ive heard is likely its like u cud wind up wit nothin or u cud alternatively wind up wit a 60000gbp job thrice our tuition fee..and how am i supposed to predetermine my job opp now?.well if im in the former situation altho im gonna try damn hard NOT to be... it wudnt be very nice bcos they dont care if u went to lse here all that much and i guess they wud know how desperate ur situation is if ur job hunting in india and then try to squeeze u..i have recurring nightmares of how im gonna get a 20000rs job after paying in lacs for my degree. so then i think trying to leverage ur lse degree in a top notch indian b-school placement might make sense..again not smthing im sure abt tho..and well since i will not hav emis and loan payments to worry abt..i thot this was something i very well may consider..the reason im not considering an mim is bcos ive heard from several ppl that they're pretty lame and a very sad substitute for a mba..no less from the starter of this thread altho in a much politer manner and well acc to my frnd at lse(doin msc in fin there and the sourse of most of my info)..25% of the various fin courses junta opt for and do consulting jobs so i should be good. well actually acc to him i could evn do a mktg job if i like as long as i hav lse on the resume and a good enuf reason...but i do think thats a little extreme.well i dunno really..mayb i shud stick wit imt and choose to do smthing specialised later.. or take cat'11 while at imt..that way i hav nothing to lose...well except a year of my life...:(

My point was that it was just too much money to be paying for a profile enhancement on the Indian scene. With that objective, I guess that Distance Diploma or CFA does the same enhancement- proves your finance knowledge. But if you're keen on trying out your luck at the London market, by all means go ahead.
sounds good..but wudnt u b betr off just applyin to places in the us?pricier i know.but betr reputed for the ms fin courses+betr job opp+no crazy visa issues&labor; mkt tests. i know i wud but i hav a 3ydc:(


Let's see. There are issues in the US too, job security is close to nil, as TraderJoe1976 pointed out, you get fired once every 3 years at a Hedge Fund (which is what I'm targeting), and you need to stick to the same employer for 12 years to get a GC, what not. So need to think very hard before taking any decision. Need to use this nice Indian skill called jugaad.

I don't think my application is competitive enough for the best now (Columbia, UCB, MIT), and if I'm paying that much money, I'll not settle for anything lesser than the best, even if it means I spend 2 more years enhancing my profile (GRE Math, CFA, Work experience). God has blessed me with great parents, who despite being upper middle class are willing to support my stratospheric dreams.

Cheers
862

@rust in peace: i guess what ur saying does make sense(paying too much for too little@lse unless my 60grand a year dream works out): sigh: if only there were some kind of guarantee on that.. i am too skeptical abt the mim so that is def out...i guess id probly be betr off makin my peace wit imt and enhancing my profile and den trying for the above mentioned jobs at a european/us school. i stil do wish to hear wat baccardi says tho ....anyway thanx for ur insight:) and best of luk:) hope u do fulfil ur stratospheric dreams:)

863

Hey Puys

Found this thread out of the blue. Great discussion going on. Had some questions. I hope they have not been answered before... didn't get time to browse through all the posts :oops:

1. Is it worth studying in a Foreign Ivy league b-school after passing out from one of the top in India and working for around 3-5 years? Does it add considerable value to you in terms of career growth(definitely does in terms of exposure)

2. Does an MBA from a top Indian business school give u an edge when you apply to these schools?

I am giving another MBA(foreign) some thought after this one. Hence...


thanks

864
can you be a little more specific and advice me on which to choose btw MIS (management information systems), Carnegie Mellon and MBA, NUS only considering career prospects, money, stability and job satisfaction for short term, medium term and the long term ?

I am extremely confused as to whether I should choose MIS bec I am attracted to the US market or the MBA because I feel that its a better degree and probably may fetch better job roles and help in the long run.

Abt MIS, I am worried for its limited ability to push my career or help me in the medium to long term. Abt NUS MBA, I am worried about its brand value to enable me to get those startegy consulting, business development kind of roles. I am not sure my understanding about either is correct ( US marrket is better for earning,career, stability) or ( MBA is better because its a better degree and probably may fetch better job roles and help in the long run ).
Please advice based on your experience. As u rightly guessed, I have 5 years of exp in IT in a global MNC, out of which I have spent 2 years abroad.
Thanks.


With your profile and erstwhile career as an IT/IT Consulting firm, you'd be better served with a business focused degree like the MBA with tech electives to get into an IT / Operations / Systems consulting role. Unless you want to specialize in IT (technical) as a long term career, an MIS is unlikely to meet your career goasl (as you have communicated thus far).

NUS (and its Singaporean equivalent NTU) have been passed by more dynamic schools in the region, notably INSEAD, CEIBS and Tsinghua. If you're looking at IT /Strategy consulting with the Accentures, SAPs, Deloittes of the world, you want to gain an education in the schools from where these companies recruit in large numbers and where career services offices have the experience, street-cred and the resources to attract these firms, and have the competence to train you to get recruited; neither of which NUS is known for. I just feel the resources in NUS will not be adequate to support your career jump, in which case the quantum of effort you need to make will increase without the training and guidance a strong career office can give you. NUS is not known to have a strong and proactive careers office.

Noticed on a different thread that you have admits to McCombs Austin and Georgetown as well. McCombs shares University space with UT Austin's Engineering school, have you thought about the possibilities there? The US schools like McCombs & Georgetown will have their own tech & strat-consulting clubs with strong ties to wide and numerous Alumni (both from McCombs Engg school as well as the tech school).

Either above or I am simply not understanding you :-), in which case apologies.

All the best
Baccardisprite
865
Surabhi M Says
well i hope to god ur rite:)(abt the dubai/singapore bit i mean)...i dont really mind the job hunt and stuff but its kinda hard to do LSE when i know that I could probly sleep at IMT for 1.5 yrs and still get atleast a >7 lac placement whereas at LSE wit a job hunt+part time work+studying my ass off+3lac odd extra in terms of tuition+cat'11...i mite wind up with nothing!!! altho if I do wind up with something...i guess its really gonna be worth it:) btw, did u apply to the oxford mfe? im still awaiting a reply from them.altho i still like my LSE offer better in terms of the course offerings and tuition fee..and thats another factor..cos i dont want a pure finance role anyway.have my heart set on consulting/gen or strategic management cos im not sure if im goin to like investment banking and all that very much:(.well yeah i did try going on linkedin yesterday to look for some alumni..but then started watching a FRIENDS rerun instead..will be doin that soon..i really do wish i could get Baccardi's perspective on this also.. where is he?.and if I go to LSE now and do IIM/XL/FMS in 2012...will that extra lse degree finally help me in the placements I get?(assuming i cant land a job i like)..cos I will be superior to the other candidates in terms of academic knowledge right? cos im sure a year at lse is worth 2 yrs at coding..which is wht most of batchmates will probly have..or am I being very naive abt that? god im so confused rite now:lookround:..anyway where are u headed...anything in the pipeline?


Without experience you'd be hard pressed to convince an employer to hire you. If you want to get into consulting, any employer is likely to choose a locally educated, culturally aware (no, being Indian & speaking English doesn't make you "aware" of UK culture) person over you. How will you deal with that? What are you bringing to the table in terms of experience, competence and transferable / applicable skill? At age 22-23 (when you will graduate)? Over & above '000s of unemployed graduates and experienced professionals from the recent recession?...Think this over carefully.

At 22-23, the path of lower resistance to the consulting career you seek is to work for a year, simultaneously prepare for the CAT/XAT and try getting into one of the Top IIMs, FMS, JB, SP Jain, MDI, IMT... IMT-G is not a bad school. After an Indian MBA you cuold do 5-6 years of consulting / or similarly client interactive, then go to the UK / anywhere else for another Masters / MBA and employers will look at you very differently, perhaps dangle more than 60K to attract you :-).....

All the best
Baccardisprite

P.S - (your 1st post) I am old and don't get sms language.. Mind writing full words and sentences :-)?....
866
Thanks for your reply

Due to circumstances it would be ideal for me to do some sort of degree in europe or even america. I don't want to do an mba in any of these places because the good ones require work experience and right now i only have 3 months of work ex. I want to supplement my undergraduate degree with a msc and with an option ( which i would likely take up) to do an MBA later.

Really would like your thoughts on this.


Care to elaborate your "circumstances"? Unless something potentially disruptive, you're taking a myopic view of your life chasing "some sort of degree" just because you seem forced by circumstances. Wrong approach, stunted process. What prevents you from finding a marketing job or trying to get into a marketing career in India through a top notch PGDM?

I am not trying to be difficult here. Just want to help you ask yourself the right questions. Those should be centered around your professional goals, not a degree.

All the best
Baccardisprite
867
Profile:
Btech mech : Thapar university 7.7 CGPA
Work-ex: 3 years (Hindustan Petroleum Corporation Limited)
Have been handling Operations & internal audits. I m looking for a role in Operations/supply chain management
Please guide me whether I should look for MS/MSc for seeking desired job opportunity in the operations sector or I should go for MBA with operations as Major. Considering my work-ex 3 years please suggest me some univs. Other option I think of is gaining some more work-ex like total of around 5 or 6 years and simultaneously building my profile with certifications like PMP etc and handling more diverse profiles in my current job.
So suggest me which option to go for like some specific one year course related to operaions/SCM aftr 5 yrs work-ex or Genral MBA with Operations as Major next year.


LGO Program at MIT-Sloan/Engineering - Global Operations Management MBA | MIT OR Kellogg MMM program; or Stanford MS&E; Graduate Program with x-registry at Stanford Business School. Alternatively - The Georgia Tech / TLI Singapore Masters Program in Supply Chain Management....

All the best
Baccardisprite
868

@Baccardi: So sorry about the sms language!! In hindsight I feel it must be rather rude and inconvenient for my reader(In this case you). My only excuse is I am young and a serial texter;) So imt huh..but what about jobs through LSE in Dubai/Singapore/India and other locations? Well barring a few places(For instance the idea of living in China really scares me!), I am not that fussed when it comes to geography. Those are hard to get too? And the whole LSE+Cat11 option? Could my LSE education/experience/degree add any value to an IIM/XL/FMS level placement or is the whole scheme too hair-brained? Given that I already have an IMT in hand, is that really worth two IIMs in the bush+LSE? I'm sorry if I seem kind of fixated on LSE, I guess that might be slightly irritating but its kind of hard to choose Ghaziabad over London+future IIM calls/a hard to get yet possible if I am lucky job out of LSE:) especially when all my friends, family, acquaintances think I must be retarded to even think about IMT when I have LSE and my parents are positively outraged at the idea of their darling daughter having to spend 2 years at Ghaziabad and are positively trying to force LSE down my throat:-/. One last insight perhaps?:)

869
Surabhi M Says
@Baccardi: So sorry about the sms language!! In hindsight I feel it must be rather rude and inconvenient for my reader(In this case you). My only excuse is I am young and a serial texter;) So imt huh..but what about jobs through LSE in Dubai/Singapore/India and other locations? Well barring a few places(For instance the idea of living in China really scares me!), I am not that fussed when it comes to geography. Those are hard to get too? And the whole LSE+Cat11 option? Could my LSE education/experience/degree add any value to an IIM/XL/FMS level placement or is the whole scheme too hair-brained? Given that I already have an IMT in hand, is that really worth two IIMs in the bush+LSE? I'm sorry if I seem kind of fixated on LSE, I guess that might be slightly irritating but its kind of hard to choose Ghaziabad over London+future IIM calls/a hard to get yet possible if I am lucky job out of LSE:) especially when all my friends, family, acquaintances think I must be retarded to even think about IMT when I have LSE and my parents are positively outraged at the idea of their darling daughter having to spend 2 years at Ghaziabad and are positively trying to force LSE down my throat:-/. One last insight perhaps?:)


It's all possible, getting a job in London is possible, as it is in Dubai / Singapore and India.

Try and take a contextual approach. You'll be 23 when you graduate LSE and competing with other (local in the UK, local in Singapore) 23-25 year olds, of similar education and ambitions.... When employing all of those others is logistically (they're local), financially (equal or lower salary) and administratively (work-permits / visas etc) easier, what are you bringing at to the table at 23 that's different enough to overcome the 3 potential barriers just mentioned? Like I said, after a Masters Degree, professional skill you bring to the table is 75% of the reason why an company will hire you; the brand of your school + quality of education will make up the best of the remaining 25%. At LSE, the hustle factor in your job search is going to be high wherever you end up searching. A path of high resistance. When you get a job, you will start at the same level and similar salary (20-24K) as a UK Bachelor's degree holder. So what's the professional value of an LSE degree now?

I am not trying to discourage you. But think about how you address the challenges above. Are they addressable, and when are they addressable most effectively? Now, with no skills and no professional competence under your belt or 5-6 years later when you have the 75%? What's your path of lower / least resistance?

By the way, even if you're not financially pressed, what's the use of spending INR 20-25L for a year in LSE and coming back to study in the IIMs? Would I be the only one thinking that's a waste?

On the other hand, a good Indian MBA, means you start at a "good" salary in India (INR 7-8L average), hopefully strong career growth in the 2nd fastest growing and dynamic economy in the world, you'll gain skill, success and the ability to manage in fast changing environment.

Had you asked me 10 years ago, I would've said LSE eyes closed... Times are different now, the world is different now - east is where the action is, and you want to be where the professional action and the growth is.

If you're so into the IIMs, get a job for the next year or so, study n prepare for the CAT and have a go again. But don't count out IMT-G so easily. The school may not be an IIM ABCL, but it's a good school, it's Alums have gone on to excellent careers (I know one personally), and INR 7L in India is not to be scoffed at, it's as good / better as 40K in London!

Summary - what is your path of lower resistance to get where you want to be in your career (say) 10-15 years from now? Are your challenges addressable? If yes, with what, and when?

All the best
Baccardisprite
870

Wow, what insight in that post!

Usually people only talk in tangible terms (industry/salary/placements) of a particular course, but this perspective and insight is absolutely invaluable. It is like learning how to think, than what to think. Baccardi's insight was the reason I dropped the plan of an immediate Master's post UG, and I think it'll serve me well. Will be interning at one of JP Morgan/Goldman/Credit Suisse/Ernst & Young/KPMG/BSE for a year or so, and then will reassess my situation. This thread has literally been a turning point for my career.

Hats off to you, Bacardi + Sprite (I prefer thums up though :D)

871
Wow, what insight in that post!

Usually people only talk in tangible terms (industry/salary/placements) of a particular course, but this perspective and insight is absolutely invaluable. It is like learning how to think, than what to think. Baccardi's insight was the reason I dropped the plan of an immediate Master's post UG, and I think it'll serve me well. Will be interning at one of JP Morgan/Goldman/Credit Suisse/Ernst & Young/KPMG/BSE for a year or so, and then will reassess my situation. This thread has literally been a turning point for my career.

Hats off to you, Bacardi + Sprite (I prefer thums up though :D)

@Baccardi: thanks so much:) love your no nonsense/not mincing any words approach to our stupid queries(mine in this case). Totally agree with Rust. Its just all that negative stuff on PG wrt IMT..and people choosing other schools whose exams I didnt even take/forms I didnt even fill over it!...whoever thought that there was no such thing as bad publicity should do a case study on IMT-G:).But i guess I just need to think of how the best I have(In this case IMT) fits into my scheme of things and then its not so confusing and it makes total sense to chuck LSE. Did you know that you absolutely rock?:cheerio:(Rhetorical question..no need to answer it).Thanks once again!
872

I wanted a advice from everyone of you.
I have got offer for msc international business/management course from following colleges

leeds university
lancaster management school
strathclyde university
Henley Business School
Aston Business School
University Of Bath
St. Andrews

Should I go and study in uk msc ?
Are the job conditions good there?
or my another option is MBA gen. from amity university nodia
or should i go for job.

It will be really nice if you help me out regarding this
I really want this info earlies as I have to accept the offer, last date is near

873
I wanted a advice from everyone of you.
I have got offer for msc international business/management course from following colleges

leeds university
lancaster management school
strathclyde university
Henley Business School
Aston Business School
University Of Bath
St. Andrews

Should I go and study in uk msc ?
Are the job conditions good there?
or my another option is MBA gen. from amity university nodia
or should i go for job.

It will be really nice if you help me out regarding this
I really want this info earlies as I have to accept the offer, last date is near


Maybe you can help us a little by telling us:

1) Why you don't want to work now and go for a Masters degree? What is likely to add to your career (question is not university or course specific)?

2) What would you like to do in your career? Functionally, Type of company / industry and geography?

3) Why are you asking these questions after you apply and get offers?

The UK is a challenging place for anyone right now. You neither have the experience & skills to compete with easier to hire and equally educated locals (zero out of 75%), nor are the universities listed above absolutely the top grade to get you the best of the 25%....

Not trying to be difficult here, but think and post again please :-)

All the best
Baccardisprite
874

hi !!
i see some excellent advice on this forum...to the long list of questions, i would like to pose one myself...any help is deeply appreciated..
i am a chemical engineer and have about 8-9 months of work experience, i appeared in cat 9 and cat 10 as well...and scored 97 and 99 %iles respectively, but unfortunately had no calls whatsoever, due to a low score in DI section...and have absolutely no intentions of appearing again..
I applied for masters in management and have offers from imperial business school and cass business school as well for msc management. my intention of going for this course is that I wish to transform/change my career path.
I am pretty sure of the reasons due to which i am applying for this degree...but a greater dilemma faces me...i am confused between which univ to choose/reject. imperial has a greater pedigree as brand name, but cass has a better Bschool and course structure, while imperial BS name on my resume would be impressive and would help me to get some interviews, Cass BS has a better course content. can any1 plz help me out with this dilemma.
looking forward to your thoughts as well Mr.baccardisprite...thanks 😃

875

Hi Baccardisprite,
What are your thoughts about MICA.I have an offer and I'm inclined to join, but in terms of the brand name of the college, do you think its good enough to have it as my last degree?
I know I wanna take up marketing(brand management) only and what MICA offers is exactly what I want,but would it be advisable to wait a year and try to get into FMS/IIMs? or is it as good as the IIMs?