hi jamiroquai i v been reading ur thread religiously.i am a govt class 1 officer.i l b joining xlri dis year.my reason ws 2 get into ibd(for fat salaries).from ur posts i fathom dat xl wil get me into a bb.but as i talked to ppl who hav pasd out frm dere,d bb's are biased towards iim abc only.as i v cm 2 know traesury et al roles are given 2 ppl in xl.hope i m wrong and please substantiate with sm example.as i m in a dilemma.i v talked 2 seniors about dis and dey say dat i shud try forA,B,C for nxt year bt den my wrk ex will increase to two years which will hamper my chances of getting into a bb. thnx in anticipatn
Please write in proper English..
FYI writing in sms lingo is also against PG rules..
How is School Of Investment Banking for breaking into BB IB ? I'm an engineering graduate with 2.5 yrs of work in IT. Should I go for their full time programme ? Your views pls.
Where do you think Quants (Quantitative financial analyst) specially Algo Trading Quants fit into IB scene?
Are they in Front, Mid or Back Office?
S&T; is not a core investment banking activity. It is one of the revenue generating activities that investment banks undertake, but is not investment banking per se.
... I am more interested in Quant type of job, is it really an I-Bank operation and most importantly, do they get their bonuses from the same pool as the "bankers" get?
hi jamiroquai i v been reading ur thread religiously.
Oh? But not a single thank you on any of my previous posts? :shocked:
....my reason ws 2 get into ibd(for fat salaries).
IBD is way more than monetary compensation. This is the only job where you learn more about the industry in one year than most people in 10.
from ur posts i fathom dat xl wil get me into a bb.but as i talked to ppl who hav pasd out frm dere,d bb's are biased towards iim abc only.
You're right - they're very oriented toward IIM-ABC.
as i v cm 2 know traesury et al roles are given 2 ppl in xl.hope i m wrong and please substantiate with sm example.as i m in a dilemma.i v talked 2 seniors about dis and dey say dat i shud try forA,B,C for nxt year bt den my wrk ex will increase to two years which will hamper my chances of getting into a bb. ...
I don't think 2 years workex will ruin your BB chances. 3+ years will.
hi, i m goin to join into an MBA prog. and i hav an interest in investment banking. so how can i do invest banking. and which stream shud i select in my MBA so tht it can b helpful in IB. i wud be very thankfull if anyone suggests me
1. I have heard that the front office investment bankers have to look for the opportunities themselves. I mean they have to identify clients themselves for M&A; , debt and IPOs.Earlier I thought the client would come to the bank itself for deals. though this would happen if the relationship already exists. Is it that these front office bankers are themselves looking for deals and meeting CFOs even if the Client is not on a look out for m&a; or an IPO???I guess that is why u said clean shirt , decency and all . Oh man investment banking is more of sales
2. This question might be irrelevant but I guess there no one else who can answer this. What is treasury in a bank and what are the various roles offered to an MBA who is recruited for the treasurey department?
... 1. I have heard that the front office investment bankers have to look for the opportunities themselves.
In BB's: The Managing Directors use their existing relationships to get deals.
In MM's: Senior personnel use their relationships to bring in business.
In Boutiques: Deal pipeline is usually volatile and therefore pressure is put on everyone in the hierarchy to create 'sales'.
I mean they have to identify clients themselves for M&A; , debt and IPOs.Earlier I thought the client would come to the bank itself for deals. though this would happen if the relationship already exists. Is it that these front office bankers are themselves looking for deals and meeting CFOs even if the Client is not on a look out for m&a; or an IPO???I guess that is why u said clean shirt , decency and all . Oh man investment banking is more of sales
To answer your question directly - YES - as part of their activity to generate investment banking revenue, investment bankers must identify firms that need the products that they're selling. Such firms would include a company which would get super value from the market by IPO-ing. Or a firm that could refinance debt at a cheaper rate. In this manner, the bankers bring options to the company's table.
If you understand that not every deal is done because the company thought of it. In most cases, only the banks are sophisticated enough to be able to model the financial impact of an M&A; (or other major financial deal) correctly. This is why deals are proposed by bankers to corporates.
That being said, you also have situations where corporates approach bankers for their products.
Also, I do not recall mentioning "clean shirt", "decency", etc. I think you are making this up for dramatic effect - and this is very disappointing, coming from you. Even if you believe that this is purely a sales job, you will appreciate that the clientele consists of CEOs and CFOs - and they won't pay you an exorbitant fee unless they believe that you're very smart & have got the skills and means to get the job done well.
2. This question might be irrelevant but I guess there no one else who can answer this. What is treasury in a bank and what are the various roles offered to an MBA who is recruited for the treasurey department?...
I am unable to talk to corporate finance division roles
1. The ability to be smart and presentable. This includes the way you dress yourself, communicate and think. If you're sloppy in the manner in which you come across, have your hair in disarray, shirt with stains / smells, etc, thats a definite no-no. I know this sounds silly, but trust me - investment banking is a relationship business and you have to come across as someone who the client can look up to and trust for the best quality services.
3. A friendly and pleasing personality. A lot of banks say that you are being hired not as an Associate, but as a future MD. This means you will be involved in bringing in business - which means you will need to have cultivated relationships with clients and be on good terms with them. This would require you to have a personality that would allow you to gel well with them. Also a friendly personality is a must because your colleague would not want to work with a prick for 17+ hours / day, right?
I am sorry if I offended you , but you mentioned this very early on this thread. I had no intentions of making it dramatic. And sorry If I misunderstood any thing by this post of yours
In BB's: The Managing Directors use their existing relationships to get deals.
In MM's: Senior personnel use their relationships to bring in business.
In Boutiques: Deal pipeline is usually volatile and therefore pressure is put on everyone in the hierarchy to create 'sales'.
To answer your question directly - YES - as part of their activity to generate investment banking revenue, investment bankers must identify firms that need the products that they're selling. Such firms would include a company which would get super value from the market by IPO-ing. Or a firm that could refinance debt at a cheaper rate. In this manner, the bankers bring options to the company's table.
If you understand that not every deal is done because the company thought of it. In most cases, only the banks are sophisticated enough to be able to model the financial impact of an M&A; (or other major financial deal) correctly. This is why deals are proposed by bankers to corporates.
That being said, you also have situations where corporates approach bankers for their products.
Also, I do not recall mentioning "clean shirt", "decency", etc. I think you are making this up for dramatic effect - and this is very disappointing, coming from you. Even if you believe that this is purely a sales job, you will appreciate that the clientele consists of CEOs and CFOs - and they won't pay you an exorbitant fee unless they believe that you're very smart & have got the skills and means to get the job done well.
I am unable to talk to corporate finance division roles
I not only appreciate but admire if your clientele is CFOs and CEOs of the company. This would be a dream job as the technical part is mostly done at the back offices in India. Front office jobs are the most sought after jobs. Please don't get me wrong. I had absolutely no idea about investment banking earlier and considered only S&T; as investment banking. 99 % people believe the same. It is just because of you that there is so much clarity now. I have learnt a lot from this thread and in now way I would try to make things dramatic here on this wonderful thread 😃
I will be joining CRISIL as Research Analyst for their CCAP prog. Five years down the line is their any chance of shifting to Investment Banking.
Viz. a Viz., what all other sectors/profiles I can look into for..
Thanks.
You could look at shifting into an indian middle market bank (on their asset/lending side or on the debt syndication side). I've seen this transition happen.
Shifting from back office (BO) to front office (FO) happens.. However it works like this:
If your are in JPM's BO after an MBA from Non-ABC schools (there are some FMS/XL guys in FOs though) you have a shot at the Rothschild/Nomura and other smaller banks or in the JPM FO if you are really good.. But the catch is in the numbers.. Lets take Nomura.. They have a 400-500 member back office and 20-30 member frontoffice..
Hence, there are 2-5 openings every year in in FO.. And 50 applicants for every job (I am talking proper tier-1 IIT/IIM people with I banking MO/BO type experience)
For undergrads the numbers dwindle further since only Rothschild has an official program.. There are 1 or 2 undergrads in most front office desks per bank as one off cases.. Some are IIT/Stephens etc toppers other are from jugaad
In the US a typical undergrad analyst class per bank will be 50-70 analyst per year.. So in India a very small industry size and thousands of MBAs per year has resulted in too much supply of interested candidates
Hope you have got a good handle on the situation here.. BO to FO is certainly possible but needs very efficient networking and skill addition on the applicant's part..
Ooops I am not too sure if it 's back-office analyst or front-office analyst...
In all possibility it must be back-office.. what must be the profile for these people???
N is it a possibility for a back-office guy to get a move on to front-office job?
... In all possibility it must be back-office.. what must be the profile for these people???
Back-office roles are infinite. Starting from market research to analytics to valuations to making power point presentations - everything you could possibly imagine.
N is it a possibility for a back-office guy to get a move on to front-office job?...
HI, I am very much interested in IB, while reading this thread, I am a little confused about a few things, I have been reading a lot abt IB on foreign sites, but this gave me an Indian perspective. I have a few doubts. 1. I jus read few pages back that the transition frm boutique to BB doesnt happen due to "status".And that they only want IIM ABC Now I am taking admission through CET this yr, does it mean that except JB, none of them wud let me break into IB? I dint read any such thing on the ib scene abroad, in fact the analysts were undergrads
2. Can I work abroad as an IB with an Indian MBA, after experience in India, I know its a very open question, depends on a lot of factors, but I just want to know if its possible
3. Do IBs in India make a lot more than other MBAs? I mean since I am not from IIM a, b or c, does it make more sense to pursue consultancy or somethin else?
India is the boomtown of the world and hence IB makes sense here in a long run.. Secondly, the difference between boutiques and BB is not clear in India.. Example, in 2011 Jefferies has done better than many BBs.. 2008-10, Rothschild did bumper business, better than most BBs...
For a global perspective on what is hot and what is not check out Vault Prestige rankings for banks (not the usual best to work banks)..
Beyond IIMs and ISB very less is recognised overseas. Bombay B Schools have a networking advantage and hence the smart guys from JB, NM etc do better than many candidates from IIMs in a long run.. But I am talking about STUDs who can network through the most elitist of places..
Hope this helps!
HI, I am very much interested in IB, while reading this thread, I am a little confused about a few things, I have been reading a lot abt IB on foreign sites, but this gave me an Indian perspective. I have a few doubts. 1. I jus read few pages back that the transition frm boutique to BB doesnt happen due to "status".And that they only want IIM ABC Now I am taking admission through CET this yr, does it mean that except JB, none of them wud let me break into IB? I dint read any such thing on the ib scene abroad, in fact the analysts were undergrads
2. Can I work abroad as an IB with an Indian MBA, after experience in India, I know its a very open question, depends on a lot of factors, but I just want to know if its possible
3. Do IBs in India make a lot more than other MBAs? I mean since I am not from IIM a, b or c, does it make more sense to pursue consultancy or somethin else?
