I am a graduate of the prestigious University of Chicago in Economics (with a minor) in English literature.
However, I did not take up any internships in the US because I did not know how to get them. Therefore, I have come back to India with a BA Economics UChicago and no experience and no finance or accounting skills. Is it possible to be trained in Finance and Accounting. I have also just done my GMAT and have got a 740. I want to go back to the US for an MBA, and get recruited at the Associate level by any prestigious bank. I am from a family business background, so no one in my family has ever heard of investment banking or consulting. The males in the family are Directors in the business and the females are housewives. All my cousins are pretty unambitious - doing architecture, for example, in RV College Bangalore and are content with a Rs. 30,000 salary per month. I am not. I want to earn at least $200,000 per year as an associate in an ibank in USA.
Questions:
Will anyone in India give me pre-MBA experience?
Will any top business school in the US take me based on what I have told you?
I can get recommendations from my family. Will they count for b-school, given they are directors in my company, which is, incidentally, very powerful in Karnataka.
Will a CFA help at all? I am quite burnt out of studying at UChicago.
Hello, Jamiroquai I have a question if a guy after graduation wants to get into IB career but don't want to do MBA than which course should he opt and from which institute. It would be great if provide name of institutes in India and abroad.
my query is it worth to do IB course from School of investment banking(SIB) mumbai after 2 years of IT experience.What could be expected career ,salary after that?
Will one get job that MBA from tier-3 colleges get and will it become hurdle in future promotions as 1 does not have full time degree MBA in IB .
P.S. # My question may seem naive,please provide any assistance you know
PLEASE REPLY Hello Jamiroquai and others, I am in std 12th with PCM. During these days, I discovered that I wanna be an ibanker. It wasn't a haphazard decision , as after reading books like 'one up on wallstreet' and going through the sites like mergers and inquisitions, I am pretty sure that I'm genuinely interested . Now, what I came to know with all the mixture of obfuscations and reality floating around us, is: 1) Go to a target school and get the interviews/internship 100x easily. 2) If you're from non-target- Cold call and network like a ninza, dont get pissed off and target boutiques, then make your way up from there. I know getting an internship is next to impossible from the big boys in business like MS/GS /KKR etc if you're not from any IIT'S/ BITS/SRCC/HANSRAJ etc and what adds to that is, we dont have regular analyst roles (maybe miniscule) as mba comes so cheap. Now, my questions: 1) I don't want to get to IIT's and learn how to double differentiate and rediscover physics- if my ultimate aim is dealing with some of the smartest people alive in planet at Wallstreet. Neither I can score 100% (in boards) to get to srcc (they always prefer commerce students and hence the pcm cutoff is ridiculusly high)- The guys who score 99.99% in cats and golden 800 in gmat and 100% in boards are more suitable for Phd & then maybe move to equity research than doing mba (my personal views, no offence). So where should I go? Bachelors in finance and investment analysis from SSCBS? I think it's the right move but I'm afraid If I'll stuck in back office jobs?
2) I think, for a Indian student who want to work with the GS/MS at wallstreet- MBA from US is a necessity than a vanity. whats your opinion about branch transfers? I mean- Is it possible for a GS guy working as 2nd year analyst at bangluru, to get shift as 1st yr analyst at Newyork city?
3) with my research, I am quite aware of the fact that getting to top private equity like blackstone or KKR is damn tough, only harvard 'baker' scholer can tame those big beasts. It's THAT competitive. So, working as analyst in India for 2-3 years and then apply for Ivy league schools and apply for these top private equity frim is a smart move?
4) The top tire business schools are now being baised with guys having finance/economics background because they want diversity in there class and hence preferring engineers? Is it true or a myth? Why they're opting for the guys for whome life is a 'profit and loss' statement? They seriously need to watch 3 idiots. on the other hand bank prefer guys with these background. I want you to advice me what 'extra' activites you've done during your undergrad edu to make yourself stand out- Can you please point it out specifically.
I know all the hard work and bad hour you've to put in and you'll look like 40 when actually you're 25. No social life, vitamin "she" deficiency and blood running on your coffee system. I know it all. but, I feel If you're genuinely intrested in finance- The it's not a nightmare (I'm taking about exciting works in newyork) not back office and 'captive'/3rd tier KPO's in India. Please help. Thanks.
@Thewallstreeter you are atleast 8years away from interviewing for a b-school and 10years away from interviewing for a real i-Banking job. A lot can change between now and then. While I admire that you are starting this early i also want to offer a word of caution - please do look at other options with an open mind. There are plenty of exciting careers out there and your decision to go down a particular path shouldn't be influenced by reading a few books and perusing a couple of websites. This is the perfect period to explore life - the kind of options available to you - travel, learn a new language, a new instrument, start a business, join any NGO and make a real difference, become well-read!! There is so much you can do!!
Go through some of the profiles listed here and see if in a few years you can say the same about yourself. If not, what seeds can you plant today that will bear fruit for you tomorrow?
NO, a 2nd year analyst at GS WILL NOT break into a 1st year analyst at NY. Come on man!! Why would/should they pick you over the hundreds of people already in America applying for those positions, some with MBAs and related work-ex? Not to mention if you are coming from India there is always the work-visa thing - which in turn is going to be interesting over the next 5-years.
As to point4 - whom are you referring to? AFAIK, Indian b-schools are starting to look at non-engineers and Int'l B-schools pretend to be open to non-engineers. You are being naive(and very foolish) if you think those people will watch 3-Idiots and change their outlook on life. It's not going to happen so deal with it.
please do more research before going down this path. Mergers and ACQUISITIONS,PE are one of the toughest industries to break into. You need a hard-core quantitative background AND a top-MBA. So Yes, getting into an IIT will help you a lot more than any other course.
Finally, a little more respect for the fairer sex please. She is not a piece of property that you will get to own. Least of all in America where an at-fault divorce will easily half your net-worth.
ďťż@Neo2000 Firstly, about the fairer sex thing- It was just for light humor and wasn't intended to hurt anyone's feeling. I'm very sorry, If in case, I have.
Back to business. I'm 5years away form interviewing for a B school after 3years UG and 2years workex. Reason- I'm very sure about what I want to do- I want to see my self at wallstreet carcking big deals. ASAP. Thats probably the only reason why 120hours/weeks thing never haunted me. There're lot of people out there who actually relish this lifestyle. Everthing is so fast and efficient. woah!
About your IIT advice- You're are advising me just like my dad use to do- Get to IIT's first and then think about what you want from your life because 'brand' IIT will never loose it's sheen. Right? But dude, Government of india invests its own $ 30,000 on every individual IITian, just for a single aim- To induce india with a whole new bunch of 'technocrates' who will contribute to the world of science and technology rather than getting out and digging the corporate world. It's becoming a 'by default' process here in small towns (Patna). As I said earlier, I don't want to waste 4 years dealing with how a capacitor works If I want to deal with money at wallstreet. I am not saying this because I can't get to IIT's. Not to brag, but I am a kvpy scholar and fiitjee's ftre AIR 15. so, basically, getting there is not a big deal for me. But when I'll interview for a ibanking frim, I don't want to say- 'I was interested in mechanics and 'suddenly' discovered that It wasn't my piece of cake and hence found finance spark' The truth is you've watched wallstreet 158 times or Hrithik roshan in ZNMD and hence digging the moolah and dreaming to make 10 million$ in 5 years and retire with your own island in thiland. (Exceptions are always there) My sister is in IIT-D and I dont respect her because she's applying for Harvard as she thinks 'Its all about money, honey!" I may sound like a Practical-Idiolist but thats how I am.
No. I'm not being naive- Just because I'm very younger than you doesn't implies I'll talk nonsense and foolish. You may say that HBS(2+2) is a exception as It's more of a 'carrier switcher' tha a 'carrier enhancer' but B schools in say US want 'diversity' and opposed to india, lot of the US blonde kid are from finance/economics background and hence a engineer working in a 'blue-chip' company in India stands a better chance than a Eco hons guy from DU. I may sound 'Foolish' or wrong but I think the logic is credible. I had once chanced upon an article regarding this.
Nops. I don't agree with you that we need a strong/hardcore 'quant' background for PE/VC/HF buy side of finance or even for sell side i.e IB. Trust me. It's a myth. A banker will never do anything more than simple airthematic calculations in his entire carrier. Rockstar traders are not all gmat 800 people. Yes good acads is a trait of 'smartness' but it's not the only trait. Bankers are smart personas, not nerds.
I know H1B visa sponsership is something to worry about but markets will only get better in coming years and we can affort to be optimist about that. If branch transfer thing doesn't happens- It's disappointing. I know I need to join few NGO's and need lot of 'co-founded..." kinda stuffs in my application. I have plans like founding 'I-Banking society' fr my college- Once I get there. so that I can relate it to my post-mba goals.
I was here for a genuine advice but you guys are pretty sensitive and even drolling for a finger wagging arguments over my '3 idiots' comment- The irony of that statement was Banks in india need to realise that a finance major topper from SSCBS is more deserving candidate for analyst role than IIT-D CSE topper.
Anyway, Thanks for reply. Have a great day.
PS: I don't know why you're typed 'Acquisition' in bold font but I was talking about 'Mergers and Inquisition' website. Cheers!
@ThewallstreeterYou cannot mix practicality and idealism here. To get into i-Banking you need to go to a top b-school. To get into a top b-school, you need to show academic prowess. To show academic prowess you need to go to a school that is reputed for its exclusivity and academic rigor. And like you yourself pointed out, an Engineering degree is preferred. Ergo, go to IIT. You are focussing only on the Physics and electronics part - not the rest of the life that you will have at IIT. Believe (but you already know this), you will have exposure to a great many things that plenty of other students in most other Engineering colleges won't have. You need that kind of exposure to round-out yourself.
Please remember that you are NOT the only engineer-working-in-a-blue-chip-company applying to a b-school. Indian/Engineer/Males are one of the most over-represented categories at international b-schools because we have that many applicants. However, by its very nature, less than 10-15% of those applicants will be from IITs thus giving you an enormous advantage.
I'm not asking you to get an 800 GMAT. I'm asking you to give yourself the best possible chance to get where you want to be by taking the best options available to you at each and every step. if that means going to an IIT, so be it. Remember, b-schools always want people who they are sure will succeede and the only way you can show them that is by putting all kinds of "Brands" on your resume.
TL;DR - go to an IIT. finish in the top-10. round-out your life with extra-currics that truly matter to you. Don't worry about NGO work if you aren't interested in it.
THIS IS MY FIRST POST,I AM INTRESTED IN FRONNT END I-BANKING JOB .IHAVE GONE THROUGH THE PLACEMENT OF BOTH XLRI JAMSHEDPUR AND JBIMS MUMBAI .IT SEEMS THAT MORE FRONT END I BANKING ROLES WERE OFFERED IN JBIMS RATHER THAN XLRI JAMSHEDPUR ALTHOUGH XLRI IS RNKED BETTER THAN JBIMS IN ALMOST EVERY RANKING.DOES IT MEAN THAT JBIMS IS ALWAYS BETTER THAN XLRI IF SOMEONE IS INTREESTED IN FINANCE(FRONT END I BANKING JOBS)
AND ALSO MY ACADS ARE NOT GUD(64,72,64) BCOM GRADUATE.COULD IT BE ADETERENT FOR ME TO JOIN I BANKNG SECTOR.
@dpksingh Yes, It'll be tough buddy. No matter what you do, your past will always haunt you. You can blurr it with good performance at your b school. Keep working hard. If you can get to XLRI- It'll be a huge boost. Ergo, Go to XLRI and Graduate among the top quartile of class. Brush up your communication + interpersonal skills and network as much as you can. Good luck.
@Thewallstreeter Thanks for ur reply bro. But wHAT ABOUT jbims.I AM scoring around 99 percentiles in mocks of cmat.If i manage to get in jbims(as ihave work hard from last six months).does istand amore chance of getting in ibanks .ISNT it an easy option to take acollege with small batch Size so that ihave to compete with less number of students for getting ajob. .Is there any difference between profile offered to xlri guy and jbims guy
After IIM's , XLRI is considered as a reputated brand among the top iBanks offering fat packages. If you'll ask me- A XLRI guy with relevant work experience stands a better chance to break into finance with the reputated frim than JBMS guy. It's not the acads or infrastructure or faculty which is superior. It's the ridiculously powerful alumni network which makes a big difference. Go to linkedin and search for people from JBMS & XLRI and contact them, cold call and ask them the questions if you are really adamant on breaking into finance . It'll give you a clearer idea and will help you in 'Networking' which trust me, is very important.
If you'll ask me- A XLRI guy with relevant work experience stands a better chance to break into finance with the reputated frim than JBMS guy.
What is the basis of this comment of yours ??
How much do u know about these two schools (beyond your own perception) and their alumni's to make such sweeping statements ??
I have no dis-regard for XLRI ... have some very good friends from that campus ... but after spending donkey years in Investment Management I am ready to bet my shirt that both qualitatively and quantitatively JBIMS has a much better representation in the Investment Banking / Management domains that XLRI
I think a XII grader is better off seeking career advice on this forum ... rather than being the guide himself ... with his incomplete /incorrect knowledge about the subject
@NickLeeson Dude, Apart from being a '12th grader' (which you feel is a certificate of being a noob) , I'm a son of XLRI alumni. I don't wan't to sound pretentious but you are tempting me to do so. I asked my dad- He said after IIM's, XLRI is a 'brand' which will help in breaking into highly competitive feild like iBanking hence the comment. And then again , I have suggested him to do his own bit of research i.e through linkedin and cold-calling before taking the plunge.
Being a 12th grader is definitely a big handicap if u start passing comments about B-Schools
From your previous posts it appears that u r very passionate about IB and have done a lot of ground research already ... and i am very impressed with that
However wud advise u to refrain from passing on biased/perceptional data from ur near and dear ones
Nops, he was in Merchant navy previously, did his MBA from XLRI. Now working as a MD in a shipping company. If he were in IB, I could've easily get a summer internship from GS and a front office job at Wallstreet- without rediscovering physics 😉
Things are so bad in IB/IM these days ... that a reputed IB may even recruit u as a pre-MBA analyst just to bag that deal
Given that context i am amazed how everyone and their dogs on this thread are just dying to get into this industry ....which shrinking by the day .... and there is a lot of recently redundant Banker /analyst talent out there who r desperate to find a replacement job
It's because of the 'bad hour' They're all exausted after 2 years of hard work and eyeing for private equity or hedge funds- which offers a better lifestyle and better pay. Reason for my obsession for wallstreet- No matter how bad the conditions are NY/London will always remain the financial center of world and hence will attract the creams. Hongkong- Maybe because of 15% tax rates. In India, markets are conservative and deal size is small. Work sucks. Here client will come to you with the offer that his company is worth 500 billion when actually it's of 50 billion. You will make him believe or say bargain to that extent. That's drab. If you mean that I-Banking sucks, Then I can't agree with you. After the subprime and 2007 crash, Recovery is slow. So you might feel it's not the right time to get into. In US things aren't like that. Company WILL NOT hire you to bag just a deal. Wallstreet is known for it's 'Professionalism' The reason every tom **** and harry is digging Ibanking- where else they can fly business-class, Get the best bottles and best luxury room in 5 stars. All without taking the risk of enterprenurship. For you Information bro- Investment banking was 'least' effected by the crisis and hence aint shrinking as much as you're thinking. It's possible to be the next warren buffet in coming years. Cheers!
In my immediately previous firm (MNC IB) ....the IB team was cut from 18 to just 3 (that too analyst/associates) in a single day ... If this means "least" affected to u .... great
"For you Information bro-" .... Yes please feed me with more information about the place where i was 4 hours back ... and where i will go back in 7 hours time .... please do .... i am enlightened
